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Ten days out of nine, Emily has the decidedly unenviable task of trying to make what I write approximate English. Which can be especially tough since I tend to mintulate new wordages, throw in an extra, comma, or three,,, and spel not gud. So if anything ends up kind of, sort of making sense when it finally appears on your screen, it’s only because she and our fearless copy editors put that essay on her petite shoulders and carried it across the line.
But when she’s not sobbing over my broken English, she makes people laugh as a stand-up comedian. She has appeared in clubs on both coasts, from New York Comedy Club to Punch Line San Francisco, and is here today because I can’t think of anyone better to answer these questions. So give her a round of applause (comment-style), and hang in there as we discuss how humor can break through barriers and touch people in ways that outrage will never manage.
Mark: When you look at how things operate on right-wing media, outrage and anger seem to be the driving forces. From AM radio to Fox News, the hosts are all about being mad as hell 24/7. But when you look on the left, there seems to be much more use of humor. Whether it’s Trevor Noah or John Oliver, the biggest voices seem to be ones that box up outrage using humor. Why do you think there’s such a difference?
Emily: I think Republicans tend to be more personal. Everything is about how things touch them as individuals. How does this affect me? How much does this tax take out of my paycheck? On the other hand, I think when you look at the liberal, or Democratic way of thinking, it’s more about us. About the group. About how policies affect groups where we’re not even a part. About how things we do affect people that aren’t me, aren’t my family or friends.
And I think the ability to think that way—to think about things that don’t directly affect you and your life but realize that it all has an impact on our world—that’s required for humor. That thinking about other people, people who aren’t you or exactly like you but realizing that there is always common ground (we all have a family, were children once, have felt embarrassed or sad or any big emotion), is required for humor to work. That’s what humor is. It’s about taking something, something that on its own might produce a different emotion like anger, turning it around, processing it, and doing something different with it.
I think that from the Republican side, they take their anger straight. They’re angry about immigration or what they see in cities and they don’t want someone making them understand what the people there are thinking. That’s where Trump is successful. He’s hitting buttons that they care about. He’s talking to them in a way that makes them specifically feel heard because he directly reflects to them the things that affect them personally. He’s validating their concerns. On the left, politicians don’t do that. They work to explain how what they’re suggesting helps the group. It’s a very different feeling. And not very effective in reaching people who are still fixated on their personal concerns.
Mark: I’ve heard it said that all humor is about empathy. Is that what we’re talking about? About picturing yourself as the person at the center of that pratfall or punchline?
Emily: Well … yes and no. I think humor is also about narcissism. Many people who are comedians are lovely, broken, narcissistic people. There’s also a defensive mechanism built into it. So it’s about putting yourself, or the protagonist in the joke, front and center. That’s required for humor that’s “punching up” instead of “punching down.” You take that person and make them them focal point instead of the object of ridicule—even if something ridiculous is happening around them.
Mark: I’m going to ask you a question that I know I’ve heard before, one that probably gets asked of every comedian. Were people always telling you were funny? Were you a funny kid?
Emily: I am very small. Like … 5’ nothing. Humor has always been a defense mechanism. It’s something that helps me get seen. As a woman, I’ve never thought of myself as a gorgeous lady who turns every head when I come into the room and makes everyone say, “Oh, I need to get to know her.” But if you can get a group of people around you and they’re all laughing, that draws people in. It makes people more interested in what you have to say. It makes you bigger.
Mark: Often when we’re looking at something in the news we think is patently ridiculous, the way we write articles on Daily Kos can be pretty snarky. Do you think that kind of humor works, or should we be taking a different approach when we try to get across both these stories and, kind of, our contempt for some of these topics?
Emily: I think most of the time it works. It’s the perspective in how we talk about it—that punching up instead of punching down. This is an audience that’s pretty tuned in to what’s going on, and as long as we can use that humor to make it more of an “us against the world” situation where we’re all in this together realizing how silly the other side can be … I think that works. Sometimes it cracks me up. But it’s important not to go for the low-hanging fruit or to be unnecessarily cruel.
Mark: When we were getting started—before I remembered to start the recorder—you mentioned that you, like every other comedian, were kind of hating trying to do stand-up over Zoom. Even so, is there something coming up in the near future? Something where Daily Kos readers could come, virtually, to listen to your act?
Emily: Things are getting scheduled right now with pretty short notice so … yes? I don’t think I’ll be performing live anytime soon, unfortunately. As soon as I’m allowed to be out there safely again I will be. In the meantime, people can follow me on social media—I can’t keep my mouth shut for very long. Honestly, talking about the Zoom shows, I’ve been pretty pleasantly surprised at how well some them have gone, but I keep my expectations low.
Note: I’m hoping this is the first in a series looking at humor and other means of answering right-wing outrage. And since Emily was kind enough to point out some great targets among her colleagues (her other colleagues), expect to see another interview soon.
— Mark
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